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Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
19
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Posted - 2012.11.30 19:10:00 -
[1] - Quote
Whatever you think of Executor Heth's politics, cowardly assassination is not the way to oppose them.
I add my wishes for a speedy recovery to those already expressed and reserve my scorn for those who choose to use this horrific even as a soapbox for their personal politics.
I serve the State! |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
20
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Posted - 2012.12.01 01:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
There was a shooter. In the crowd. You don't let him get a second shot off. The coward was in a crowd of unarmed civilians when he took his shot and the Security Team's first priority HAS to be to prevent the shooter getting a second shot off.
Most of the injuries were caused by the firing of STUN rounds. I wouldn't be surprised if the deaths were caused by trampling or by adverse reactions to the Stun rounds too. As for Heth's supposed "Paranoia" and the total security that is said to have surrounded him, in the State Heth-haan is known for the risks he takes to keep himself accessible to his people. There were 12,000 people at the rally and he routinely gave such speeches in public.
Some of you are talking about things you're vastly ignorant of, just to hear the sound of your own voices. Remember that there are people reading who actually have a personal stake in this. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
20
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Posted - 2012.12.01 03:16:00 -
[3] - Quote
Caviar Liberta wrote:It also only took 1 person who's motivations for his actions are unknown at this time to set these actions into motion. In a worse case scenario you have a dead leader and an excuse for long term martial law and an even longer purge of those that might be thought not to be loyal to the state.
A worst case scenario? That is nowhere near the worst possible case. Worst possible case is that this turns out not to have been the deranged actions of a lone gunman and, Ancestors Forbid, there's ties back to another organisation or Empire and then we have a war that makes the current border disagreements look like a nature ramble.
Slightly better than that is that it only turns out to have been one, or a group, of the big Eight that were involved and the State is headed for a brutal Civil War. No, a temporary interruption of freedoms and a more active than normal Provist presence is pretty far from the worst thing that can happen.
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Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
22
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Posted - 2012.12.01 23:33:00 -
[4] - Quote
The Provist security team on the ground will have been hampered by many factors during their performance in what those who have studied such things would recognise was a nightmare scenario.
First, they would have had to have ensured the shooter could not take a second shot at their principal. This would need to be done before the Executor could be extracted from the field.
Secondly, they would have needed to extract their principal. This would need to take place BEFORE he was stablised medically and as quickly as possible, in case of follow up waves of assailants were on site.
Thirdly, they would have needed to neutralise the shooter. This would need to be done whilst ensuring that he was taken alive - simply killing him, whilst adequate for the needs of justice, would not provide the intelligence services with the data they need to determine the hand behind the attack.
Only once these three priorities were addressed would limiting collateral damage and casualties become a factor. You should know that most protection details in the Cluster train in much the same way. Very similar things would have occured if President Roden had been shot at a political rally.
I grieve for the families of those who were killed and I express my sympathies for those who, perhaps, suffered an adverse reaction to the stun projectiles used to cover the extraction of the Executor, or who were trampled in the confusion. I salute those security forces who lost their lives, no who spent their lives, in order that the shooter might be recovered alive for questioning.
To those in the State who share my shock at this attack, I say this; Now is the time for quiet introspection and for the continuing performance of our duties. We must all think well on what has happened while we are in the quiet eye of the storm because once we get to the other side of it events may make demands on us at very short notice.
Be Prepared. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
33
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Posted - 2012.12.03 18:55:00 -
[5] - Quote
Executor Heth is alive and back at work, according to an unattributed news source. Obviously, this means that worst has been averted, although there's still been no credible words as to the perpetrator's identity or ties of loyalty.
The Executor seems to have been in long meetings with Concord's inner circle since he regained consciousness. I'm glad that whatever steps he decides to take based on the information he has, the Executor has opted to make them multi-lateral through a deliberative body like Concord.
Obviously, my best wishes go out to the Executor for a complete recovery. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
36
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Posted - 2012.12.06 05:42:00 -
[6] - Quote
The Executor has caused some tensions within Caldari society by strengthening the role of a central government and giving it some oversight over the Big Eight. Some of his policies and statements have also been somewhat contentious, in the past.
On the whole, I agree with you that Executor Heth led a purge and renewal of a system that was on the verge of becoming abusive. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
38
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Posted - 2012.12.06 17:48:00 -
[7] - Quote
Diana Kim wrote:Pieter Tuulinen wrote:The Executor has caused some tensions within Caldari society by strengthening the role of a central government Like I always said, in our current situation the State must be united and well coordinated. Besides, it is the CEP who gave these powers to our Executor, because we all need it, and because he has merits to lead all of us. Making a seat of Executor was a decision not of one person, not of one corporation, but of all of them. Those people, who cause tension because of this, do not agree with all of our corporation, with our CEP, with our CPD and are clearly acting against common interests of the State.
I agree with you Kim-haani. The Executor has definitely been a force for good within the State, but there are also those who resent any form of authority being placed over the big eight, and those people are why the Executor has... Well... Enemies is a very strong word... but certainly those within the State who might be happy to see him loose the reins of power a little.
Msr En Welle was asking why anyone in the State might be stupid enough to attempt to assassinate the Executor, I wasn't expressing a personal opinion, just trying to answer him. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
43
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Posted - 2012.12.07 20:00:00 -
[8] - Quote
Kim-haani, whilst I applaud everything the Executor has accomplished I would hate to see central authority become a habit within the State. It should only be possible if an individual remarkable enough to seize it comes along and only if the circumstances demand it - as happened with Executor Heth.
Personally speaking, knowing what is 'good for the State' as a whole is well above my pay-grade. I work within the boundaries set for me by Wiyrkomi, do my duty as I see it to the best of my ability and hope that all of this is what is best for the State. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
125
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Posted - 2012.12.28 09:00:00 -
[9] - Quote
Caellach Marellus wrote:Heth having sound judgement would be like the Empress having drug fuelled orgies.
It's never going to happen.
If I were you, I'd hope that the Executor continues to exercise sound judgement. After all, he does have a sizable taskforce within strike range of the Gallente homeworld and precious few reasons to feel any love towards you all. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
168
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Posted - 2012.12.29 04:17:00 -
[10] - Quote
Andreus Ixiris wrote:Pieter Tuulinen wrote:If I were you, I'd hope that the Executor continues to exercise sound judgement. After all, he does have a sizable taskforce within strike range of the Gallente homeworld and precious few reasons to feel any love towards you all. Ah, so he'd orbitally bombard a homeworld to get what he wants, eh? My, but that sounds uncomfortably familiar...
I would expect the similarity to UNat policy to be uncomfortable for a Gallente, yes. However the Executor HASN'T actually bombarded Caldari Prime OR Gallentia. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
168
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Posted - 2012.12.29 04:30:00 -
[11] - Quote
Interesting. The State has never once said that as it's goal it has the destruction of the Federation at heart. It's possible that such a goal has never been within our grasp, is not now within our grasp and will never be within our grasp. We are a sovreign faction now, but we are not the size of the Gallente Federation, we have not the wealth of the Gallente Federation and we do not have the military strength of a fully called up and unified Gallente Federation.
We do not need to.
All the State has ever had as our goal is to be free to pursue our own vision of government. Free to pursue our own rights to self-determination and economic prosperity. James Sygarius disingenuously refers to the assault on 'Luminaire VII' so that he doesn't have to call it Caldari Prime - thus answering his own question regarding the necessity of seizing it.
Why was it necessary for the State to regain control over our birthplace? Why do any of you return home after your labours?
The State is not coming for territory or resources that is yours. We do not seek to enslave your children or seize your treasure. We do not wish to destroy your culture or threaten your way of life. Nothing that you hold dear is under threat - unless you hold dear the sometime Gallente hobby of exporting your culture where it is not wanted.
But Home? Home is ours. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
169
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Posted - 2012.12.29 05:11:00 -
[12] - Quote
James Syagrius wrote:Pieter Tuulinen wrote: James Sygarius disingenuously refers to the assault on 'Luminaire VII' so that he doesn't have to call it Caldari Prime - thus answering his own question regarding the necessity of seizing it.
Msr. Tuulinen I think if you read the associated posts to the one you chose to quote you would find I did refer to as Luminaire VII as Caldari Prime several times. The question stands.
Why was it necessary for the State to liberate Home? It was necessary BECAUSE IT IS HOME. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
189
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Posted - 2012.12.29 19:35:00 -
[13] - Quote
Lyn Farel wrote:You sound like a warmonger. The good, correct answer might simply be that a lot of what makes that conflict difficult is your unwilligness to compromise.
Imagine that I enter your home, knock you to the ground and place my boot on your throat, pressing down until your vision tunnels and you fight for consciousness.
Clearly the minimum acceptable resolution to this conflict is for me to remove my boot from your throat and retreat from your home. You would be well within your rights to demand further securities and reparations to compensate you for the experience and to deter me from doing so again. Should you recover your strength and set out from your home to track me to mine and wreak vengeance there would be many who would support your actions and many more who would understand and sympathise without agreeing with you - but you are a good and kindly person and seek nothing more than your freedom from my violence and my promise to never do this to you again.
Imagine, instead of this minimum accomodation, you were encouraged to accept my permanent presence in your home and the only dialog was over exactly how much pressure I ought to be able to apply to your throat?
I do not demand sanctions or reparations. I do not demand the return of other territories or the awarding of new ones. I do not suggest that first we must bombard Gallentia to atone for the mistakes of the past. I am willing to set aside the past in totality, start a fresh new peace and move forwards in amity and all I ask in return is that you remove your boot from my throat and leave my home, furnishing me with sufficient guarantees that you will not return unless invited. |
Pieter Tuulinen
Wiyrkomi Honor Guard
191
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Posted - 2012.12.29 23:14:00 -
[14] - Quote
Lyn Farel wrote:
Illogical.
We are speaking about a home you have never been inside, never seen except on holos, and only heard off. The home of a stranger already.
However, reparations that make sense sound perfectly legitimate to me, but you do not seem very interested as you said.
Similar situation happened a long time ago on Starkmanir Prime. Events of that magnitude happened there too, probably in an even harsher way to the point of almost annihilating an entire culture, and the Minmatar continue to ask for the "liberation" of Arzad, often for very similar reasons, even if the planet has been an Amarrian world for centuries.
Out of curiosity, would you tell the Amarr that they are wrong ?
Whether the Minmatar can accept the invasion of their homeworld or not is a matter for them, not for me, to decide. I believe there was something of a disagreement between the Empire and their former slaves, resulting in the Minmatar recapturing Pator, their original homeworld as well as other systems.
But that's got nothing to do with OUR situation. The point is that the State does NOT accept our forcible eviction from Home, that we have always publicly maintained the desire to return and that we have, in fact, successfully encompassed that desire in our liberation of Home.
Let's be clear about it. There really is no acceptable resolution to this problem that doesn't involve State control of Home. None at all. If that doesn't go on the table then the fight is not over, no matter what short term solution is forced upon us. You cannot buy your way out of this and unless you're willing to utterly dismantle the State colony by colony, orbital by orbital, fleet by fleet, you cannot force any other resolution.
Anything else is negotiable.
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